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[LincolnTalk] (no subject)

esarch

Andy, thanks for the reply and advice. U sound like someone who does a little independent thinking on his own. Congratulations!

 

A net Zero heat loss sounds like a worthy goal. But there are certain caveats that I must remind u of.

 

            1.Net Zero is like absolute Zero, a goal which can never be achieved (in physics). Is the effort worth it, if it means trashing everything? Or is it more of an obsession by some Zerorastorins?

           

            2.INSULATION, is just another of the many considerations of the design, as are waterproofing , HVAC, aesthetics (which seems to have no present representation here). Each has its role, and needs to be balanced.

 

            3 You mentioned ductwork. I would suggest a system that does not require ductwork, is flexible and uses tempered water as a medium and fancoil units as energy distribution, either hot or cold. Look it up. Just run a single pipe as supply. It is the most flexible, as the unit can bring in fresh air directly from outside and can be controlled individually, which is difficult for a ducted system. It is ideal for a series of classrooms, as they are likely to be in line. Each classroom is independent. This system also has the advantage of not needing suspended ceilings to hide ductwork. This is cleaner and can preserve the existing T&G wood decking.

 

            4. I have another suggestion: how about a monitor similar to the mill buildings we see and cherish in New England. With operable sash they create natural ventilation by exhausting hot air as the wind creates a natural “Venturi Effect” by sucking air out. Depending on the design, it can be made to allow light into the center of the spaces, reducing the need for as much artificial lighting during the day. It also can enhance the profile of the roofs, either flat or pitched with these monitors that are roughly 6’ wide, with their own pitched roofs. How about that for Net Zero, you Zerorastorins (Zoroastrians)?

 

            5. Another improvement I will suggest:  create a  continuous walkway around the buildings with an overhang. This would make the outdoors more accessible, particularly in winter. The overhangs could be designed in such a way to receive water from the roofs, diminishing the staining on siding, finishes and glazing. These overhangs would control a lot of the direct sunlight coming in through glass.

 

6.Note: none of these improvements necessitate trashing any buildings. There are many unintended consequences of the demolition. Trashing the existing structures will also mean the following:

 

  1. Our roads will be also trashed by the many trips by eighteen wheelers  filled with tons of very heavy spoils, our local roads, will be transformed into “haul roads”. They are rough: remember the Big Dig? Once used this way, they will not be fit for much else.
  2. Where do the trucks go? To some distant place far away where they create another “Brown Fields”, a lost piece  of earth that can ever be used for anything. Do not to forget to mention the diesel perfume they spreading over the   countryside.
  3. The students, in their temperary shelters, will be subject to the vibration of demolition diesel hammers as they break up concrete slabs, foundation walls and masonry. Add to that the diesel fumes and dust as the are loaded on haul vehicles. There is nothing that will contain these noxious fumes, or vibrations.

 

I support a system of recycling older structures for as much as they have to offer. This will take some patience and compromise, but will ultimately serve the town better as it will certainly save considerable cost, reduce the need for grinding tax increases, which have the effect of diminishing the value of our real estate.

 

 

 

 

 

           


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Re: [LincolnTalk] (no subject)

Andrew Payne

Edmund wrote:
 

            1.Net Zero is like absolute Zero, a goal which can never be achieved (in physics).


That is not correct.  

Completely unlike absolute zero, net-zero is very achievable (in a technical sense):  it simply means the building/site creates at least as much energy as it consumes.  

With enough solar panels (or a small nuclear reactor....just as an example to make the point), a building can actually be net-negative (net-positive?) and generate MORE energy than it uses.

Is the effort worth it, if it means trashing everything? Or is it more of an obsession by some Zerorastorins?


That is a very different issue, and to a large extent, one that has already been debated by the town.  Residents voted (definitively) for a Net Zero project.  


Regarding your suggestions, some have already been incorporated, such as the use of an "overhang", control of direct sunlight, etc.  Also, the committee has also worked hard to minimize "trashing any buildings" for the very reasons you suggest.  I strongly suggest first reviewing the project details here:  https://lincolnsbc.org  You may find that some of your suggestions are redundant. 

For HVAC issues, I'm not an architect but I am an engineer, and I know our project designers are quite familiar with the hot/cold water + air handler systems you describe.  Those systems have been around for a long time, and they still require space to put air handlers and some ductwork to source fresh air and distribute conditioned air around the room.  

Again, because this is a renovation project, the situation is very physically constrained, and we have to consider modern requirements & solutions for energy recovery, indoor air quality, CO2 monitoring, noise, room balancing, etc.  For example, since the building is ~1/4mi long with very different sun exposure through the day, some sections may be actually heating while others are cooling.  Hanging single, large, loud air handlers in each classroom (with the whole building in a single "heat" or "cool" mode) ... may not be the best idea.

Generally, though, it's my sense the constraints & tradeoff discussions on these issues have already happened, and the time for this kind of specific input was probably about 6-12 months ago.  As noted in the recent SBC update (posted here), the project is quickly approaching the "90% construction documents" phase.   

One person's view,

-andy

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Re: [LincolnTalk] (no subject)

Bijoy Misra
Andrew,
Is it possible to conclude that we got technically sound, but had to compromise on aesthetics, or may be
the looks would be different when fully done.  Is there a 3D model, hard or soft?
Bijoy

On Mon, Sep 9, 2019 at 9:45 AM Andrew Payne <[hidden email]> wrote:

Edmund wrote:
 

            1.Net Zero is like absolute Zero, a goal which can never be achieved (in physics).


That is not correct.  

Completely unlike absolute zero, net-zero is very achievable (in a technical sense):  it simply means the building/site creates at least as much energy as it consumes.  

With enough solar panels (or a small nuclear reactor....just as an example to make the point), a building can actually be net-negative (net-positive?) and generate MORE energy than it uses.

Is the effort worth it, if it means trashing everything? Or is it more of an obsession by some Zerorastorins?


That is a very different issue, and to a large extent, one that has already been debated by the town.  Residents voted (definitively) for a Net Zero project.  


Regarding your suggestions, some have already been incorporated, such as the use of an "overhang", control of direct sunlight, etc.  Also, the committee has also worked hard to minimize "trashing any buildings" for the very reasons you suggest.  I strongly suggest first reviewing the project details here:  https://lincolnsbc.org  You may find that some of your suggestions are redundant. 

For HVAC issues, I'm not an architect but I am an engineer, and I know our project designers are quite familiar with the hot/cold water + air handler systems you describe.  Those systems have been around for a long time, and they still require space to put air handlers and some ductwork to source fresh air and distribute conditioned air around the room.  

Again, because this is a renovation project, the situation is very physically constrained, and we have to consider modern requirements & solutions for energy recovery, indoor air quality, CO2 monitoring, noise, room balancing, etc.  For example, since the building is ~1/4mi long with very different sun exposure through the day, some sections may be actually heating while others are cooling.  Hanging single, large, loud air handlers in each classroom (with the whole building in a single "heat" or "cool" mode) ... may not be the best idea.

Generally, though, it's my sense the constraints & tradeoff discussions on these issues have already happened, and the time for this kind of specific input was probably about 6-12 months ago.  As noted in the recent SBC update (posted here), the project is quickly approaching the "90% construction documents" phase.   

One person's view,

-andy
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